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It's good to know that both 2, 3 and The Next Mutation are no longer considered part of the TMNT film canon. The timeline is now the 1990 film, certain events from the comics and then TMNT.

TMNT actually acknowledges Ooze and Time.

that's what i thought originally but if you look at the ooze canister on that shelf it says "TCRI" which was from the comics not TGRI from the second movie, and the septor thing is also from a comic storyline. if you look at most of the other stuff in that scene pretty much all the items refrence certain comic storylines. Kevin Munroe even stated in his inital interviews when the movie was announced that TMNT was a quasi-sequel ala Superman Returns which would take place about 3 years after the first film from 1990. I guess you could make a case that it takes place after the first 3 films if you wanted to but personally i prefer the new timeline.

btw Mike i don't know if you read it but there were prequel comics that tied into this movie that really fleshed the story out even more and i believe they are collecting them in a TPB that is being released on July 7th. i highly recommend it.

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that's what i thought originally but if you look at the ooze canister on that shelf it says "TCRI" which was from the comics not TGRI from the second movie,

Isn't there a crack over the C, meaning it could be a G? It's one of those "it could go either way" type of things.

and the septor thing is also from a comic storyline.

That may be so, but you can't deny that it's also the scepter from Turtles in Time.

btw Mike i don't know if you read it but there were prequel comics that tied into this movie that really fleshed the story out even more and i believe they are collecting them in a TPB that is being released on July 7th. i highly recommend it.

Didn't have the chance to read those issues (there were five, right?), but maybe I'll flip through the trade when / if I see it at Borders or the LCS.

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that's what i thought originally but if you look at the ooze canister on that shelf it says "TCRI" which was from the comics not TGRI from the second movie,

Isn't there a crack over the C, meaning it could be a G? It's one of those "it could go either way" type of things.

and the septor thing is also from a comic storyline.

That may be so, but you can't deny that it's also the scepter from Turtles in Time.

fair enough

Also i don't mean to burst your bubble but nothing from the 87 cartoon is ever going to creep into the current movie continuity or the new animated cartoon continuity. Peter Laird would never allow that so that's never going to happen and i say thank god for that. Krang will never be seen in any other TMNT media but i wouldn't be suprised if the Utroms that he is based on make their way into a movie because they made it into the current cartoon (they even made a krang joke in that episode).

On the topic of the current TMNT movie i thought it was excellent but the only problem i had with it was Chris Evans as Casey Jones who i thought did a terrible job. They should of got Elias Koteas to do the voice but that's just my opinion but other than that i was really happy with it although i still prefer the first movie just by a little bit. The 1990 movie, TMNT, and the 2003 cartoon are all extremly true to Eastman and Laird's original vision of the characters while still being able to do their own thing, and i have a massive respect for all the people involved in producing these excellent adaptations.

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Also i don't mean to burst your bubble but nothing from the 87 cartoon is ever going to creep into the current movie continuity or the new animated cartoon continuity.

I know, but a nod here and there wouldn't hurt.

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Sorry to hear about your grandmother, Des.

Thanks Mike.

-Everybody on here has been absolutely spectacular, not just today but in general. Sure there has been some hangups every now and then (just try to listen to episode 1 now, I dare you) but overall this has been worth everything. Special thanks to Mike for sending me a disc of the first seven episodes back in December of 2005 that allowed me to get into the show, enjoy it and be a part of it. Listening to and creating segment for this show are two of my favorite things in my life right now.

I'll second that. I listen to A LOT of podcasts, and have even met some cool people through them, but none can hold a candle to the community I feel I belong to here on Earth 2. Here's to another several hundred.

BTW Mike, when do we hear what's up for episode 200? On 101? ;)

-Des, I'll be straight with you, up till now I hadn't read or listened to any of your segments, the stuff covered in Real Dread and Dread Media just isn't my thing (kinda like anime isn't some peoples thing, right D.W.?) that said I did muchly enjoy Shred Media and the last two on your list made me interested in checking them out, my only gripe love for Feivel? That movie was spectacular.

I'll be straight as well. My enjoyment and knowledge of anime extends no further than Akira, Blood: the Last Vampire, and the eighties Tomb of Dracula movie. I don't have much interest in the genre but I appreciate the comment. I hope you'll at least listen to the special episodes (on upcoming themed epis and in an upcoming interview with a personality whose talent extends beyond mere horror cinema).

I have to get off the internet, there's writing to do and I've got to listen to this damned episode!

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What I love? You guys aren't even done talking about the first movie yet and there's still over five hours left!!!

Elias Koteas was indeed Casey Jones. He was awesome in Fallen, Prophecy, Crash (the good one, not the Oscar-winning one) and especially the Candian film Exotica. It's one of those "if you don't find this film sexy there's something wrong with you but if you do find it sexy there's also somehting wrong with you" movies.

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Crash (the good one, not the Oscar-winning one)

i remember that movie with the car crash fetishists ? david croenberg directed it if i am not mistaken. even as fucked up as it was it was still better than the oscar winning one. 'Exotica' was also quite good.

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Just the other night I started to watch Exotica (it's available through On Demand), but I wound up going to bed when I realized how late it was. Maybe I'll have to watch it now.

And I have to ask Jenny, but I think we might have seen Crash in the theater.

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  • 9 months later...
Mike i have to point out a misconception in your Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles review. you keep saying it is based on the cartoon but it is not. The only elements used from the cartoon is April being a news reporter (although she did have the antique shop from the comics), the turtles bandanas being blue, orange, purple, and red as opposed to just all being red, and the logo at the beginning of the movie. The rest of the movie is taken right out of the comics with the first 12 issues as well as the "Silent Partner", and "Return To New York" storylines.

I'm not sure I said the movie was based on the cartoon; if I recall, I said it was produced after the cartoon and I would like to have seen (and would still like to see) the cartoon continuity brought into movie continuity (at least in the form of a nod or two). If you can provide a direct quote (noting the time at which I said it, please) of me saying the movie was based on the cartoon I'd appreciate it, 'cause I honestly don't remember saying that. Then again, this week has been a blur.

One thing i am suprised you guys didn't mention is that the first Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles was the highest grossing independent film of all time up until like a year or two ago.

That factoid was in the back of my head during recording and I almost mentioned it, but I wasn't sure of its validity. So it was left unsaid.

Dear God.

I don't think I'll ever get around to listening to this in its entirety. I think the longest podcast I’ve ever listened to was around 3.5 hours. Still, I’ll probably download it regardless, maybe listening to sections at a time. The 7 hour length is rather daunting though.

That's the exact reason I'm hesitant to put 101 out this upcoming week. Listeners will need at least a week to go through 100, and I don't want to hit them with another long episode right away.

The movie is based on the darker original comics, The cartoons of the 80's lightened the TMNT, so when New Line Produced the first film they kept it dark and gloomy with little funny moments.

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Ok, I'm now listening to the review on TMNT II: Secret of the Ooze and a few questions were asked. Here are the answers on those few:

How is Bebop and Rocksteady created?

Well in the first episode of the 1987 TV Cartoon Series, Bebop and Rocksteady were part of a street gang who were defeated in a humiliating fashion by the Turtles. Shredder decides he wants to use them as leaders of his Foot Clan and they volunteer, with the promise from Shredder that they will get their revenge on the Turtles. They are transformed and become larger and a bit stronger, but remain as stupid as they were before.

Why isn't Bebop and Rocksteady used in the TMNT II: Secret of the Ooze movie?

Bebop and Rocksteady were the creations of Kevin Eastman and Peter Laird whilst co-developing the background behind the original animated series. Both hated the toning down of the characters by the second season and refused to use the goofier versions in the second movie, which the studios insisted on. This is why Tokka and Rahzar were used instead.

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Wow this brings back memories!

This was a damn good episode although i think the Turtles comics kind of got the shaft (although Mike apoligizes for that in the episode). Hopefully there is a Turtles Comics spotlight episode or something in the future. I better be on that episode though considering that i am a living TMNT encyclopedia lol.

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Now, I will attempt to give my opinions on the TV and Film Adaptations of TMNT.

Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles 1987-Animated

This was the series that most people 20 years old and up first viewed of this "Ninja Team. " From the moment the theme song starts with it kick ass sound(yea it had me dancing when I was 5) to the last episode, we get great storytelling and some fun Saturday mornings. It ran from 1987 to 1996, had 10 Seasons, 194 Episodes(this was in the days, when a studio decided to keep a hot show running passed 65). Voice acting was great and really matched with the characters they were placed on. This being a cartoon was toned a little lighter than the comic book it was based on, but is not considered canon to the Mirage Comic. It also helped introduce us to catchphrases like "Cowabanga" and "Turtle Power. " The animation was good for its day and like most Superhero(using the term loosely)shows at the time it appeared in a very colorful way. Implamenting, the Turtle Blimp, Turtle Van, etc. We were also introdoced to characters like The Rat King, Baxter Stockman and Krang who are not shown in the feature films.

One of the many changes that were made in the first film(other than tone and more adult situations)was how Splinter came to be Splinter. Here he is called Humato Yoshi and is exciled to NYC, when Shredder cause Yoshi to not bow to his their Sensai, therefore dishonoring him. When in NYC sewers, he makes friends with Sewer Rats. When he comes across the 4 Turtles who have been exposed to the Ooze, he wipes the stuff off of them on him. The Turtles being that they have made contact with a human, turn into full grown human sized Turtles, while Yoshi is turned in a Rat, because of his long exposure to the Sewer Rats. It is also contrversary as to whether or not, Shredder was responsible for the Turtles transformation, since he uses the same mutagent to turn Bebop & Rocksteady into their animal selves.

All I have to say is I loved this show, haven't seen it since it ended in 1996, but it was still fun to watch. 5 out of 10.

Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles (1990)

Wow, here is the ultimate TMNT movie. The best adaptation of the comics, with just a spice of the cartoon. From the moment the film starts, featuring a news report by April O'Niel(Judith Hoag)about the uprising of mysterious ninja-like crimes plaguing NY. The origins of Shredder, Splinter and the Turtles are presented here from the origin in the comics. The few comedic aspects are derived from the cartoon, appealing to those who hadn't read the comics(like me)and to help ensure the PG rating(although, it must have been a few inches away from a PG-13 rating). Casey Jones has got to be one of my favorite characters in all the films, because he's hard edge, blunt, right down to business, good boy, with a bad boy exterior. I did like Judeth Hoag's portrayel of April O'Neil complete with matching Yellow Rain coat(even when there's no rain) which is featured in the cartoon. Elias Koteas who plays Casey Jones, does a great job, he seemed to embody the character, like it was him. I have only see him outside of this role in Look Who's Talking Too as Kirsty Alley's brother Stuart. The puppeteers responsible for the great Turtle outfits come from the famous Jim Henson company, they also brought us the puppets in Dark Crystal and my favorite Labyrinth(which was the debut role for 15 year old Jennifer Connelly, who was in Ang Lee's The Hulk) Other than Splinter, who was voiced and played by Kevin Clash the rest of the performaces of the of 6 of the actors, seperate voice actor's were cast alongside them. Here is the rundown of Live Action Actors and Voice Actor in this film:


Michelin Sisti Robbie Rist Michaelangelo

Leif Tilden Corey Feldman Donatello

Josh Pais Josh Pais Raphael

David Foreman Brian Tochi Leonardo

James Saito David McCharen The Shredder

Toshishiro Obata Michael McConnohie Master Tatsu

This film was great and New Line Cinema and the rest of the cast and crew really gave us a good show, What happened to the rest....? 7 out of 10

Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles II: The Secret of the Ooze (1991)

Okay, when you have a franchise that kicks ass in the box office, you immediately begin to look toward bringing it back, but that kind of rushed thinking is what hurts a film that many kids and teenagers want to be done correctly. This is where it started, now grant it, it's not the worse film in the series and unlike Mike, lol I will watch it again. But it was a huge disappointment, even as a kid. I get this feeling that the studio execs, sat in the theater with a sold out crowd for the original film and jotted down every moment where the crowd made a noise and decided to bring the Cartoon version into a live action setting. It's never a good idea to bring Cartoons into a live action setting, there are ways to adapt cartoons into a feature film, but not this. First off, we are introduced to a Pizza crazed NY(or at least how they make it seem through editing). Obviously, getting us to remember right away that the TMNT love pizza(we could never forget though, can we). First off we meet Casey Jones' replacement Ernie Reyes Jr. who actually plays a decent character named Kino, who starts off as a Pizza Delivery Boy, but seems to forget later on that he even has a job, when he begins to talk and help the Turtles out. There is set time period after the first film, so we can assume that the Turtles living with April has been a while, seeing that she is obviously irritated(with Splinter being the only one, who notices this). This time April is portrayed by younger and cuter Paige Turco, who of course will play April in the third film. She actually does an okay job, but I do think Judith is a better April. I did miss Casey Jones in this and it makes no sense of where he went. At the end of the first film we are shown that April and Casey have decided to start a relationship, but no mention of a relationship or even break-up is mentioned here. The only continuity here with the first film is April higher position at the newsroom and Shredder being shown at the Garbage dump surviving(which in itself makes no sense). The biggest issue here is since this is closer to the cartoon, than the first film than where is Bebop and Rocksteady and why give us assed out characters like Tokka and Rahar? Well look at my previous reply on this forum for that answer. I know as a metalhead I will get wrapped in the cyber mouth for this, but I liked the Vanilla Ice song "Ninja Rap" Vanilla Ice is and will never be Eminem, but hey few are, right. The fight scenes are ridiculous and it seems like Raphael could be the poster child for a "Kick Me" sign, seeing as he is always the one roughed up the most. David Warner makes an appearance here as the one who made the Ooze, thereby almost being responsible for the mutation of the Turtles and Splinter. Warner is excellent in everything he does, but a scene that I don't believe was ever filmed, showed that Warners character would be revealed to be a Krang like Alien in a human form at the end. Few cast changes were made from the original characters and their actors, but here are the new Voice and Live Action actors(NOTE: Ones not mentioned are the same as the first).


Mark Taso Leonardo

Adam Carl Donatello

Kenn Scott Laurie Faso Raphael

François Chau The Shredder (Kevin Nash played Super Shredder)

Kurt Bryant Frank Welker Tokka

Mark Ginther Frank Welker Rahzar

By this time, the studio tried to appease the younger audiences and created a mess that when you turn 10, you start to realize how dumb it is at times. Can it get any worse...?

3 out of 10

Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles III (1993)

Yes, it gets alot worse, with this pile of crap. The only way this will ever end up in my DVD collection is if they release an Ultimate Box Set with all 4 films and a bonus disc(exclusive to the set). I won't spend so much time on here, because it pretty much sucks. Okay, so some time has passed since part 2 ending, Shredder is pretty much dead and no mention of him is made. We get our first glimpse of the 'New" TMNT(I mean the acne look done on the outfits)in a training sessions where they train to music. It seems to last forever, but mercefully only until the credits are done. The session stops when Hothead Raphael stops the music(surprise). Splinter is seen looking like a sorry old worn out shoe. April than appears, apparently ready to go on vacation and getting the Turtles something nice to play with while she's away. April happens to have picked up a Japanese Sceptor(which seems to have landed in an American flee market....?)for Splinter and we cut to Fuereal Japan as the same Sceptor is being used by a rebellious freedom fighter(he's helping to fight a war against his father who happens to be in league with an American arms dealer and seems to be a dictator of sorts. He is transported and replaces April, who apparently is the same size, width, weight as the Japanese warrior(I don't to remember the name). So the Turtles do a little research and discover that it is a time traveling device, but in order to go back and bring April back, they need to trade places with 4 people with their same stats. So they call upon Casey Jones(Elias Koteas, probably the best part of this film he also plays Whit in Japan), who I'm guessing was MIA in the 2nd film. So he can protect Splinter from whatever or whoever may come back in their place(as well as to keep an eye as April replacement).

Like I did on the last one, I will post the Live Action and Voice Actors who are new in this film. Corey Feldman returned as the voice of Donatello after being absent in the 2nd film(he was asked back).


Mark Platt Leonardo

Matt Hill Tim Kelleher Raphael

Jim Raposa Donatello

David Fraser Michaelangelo

James Murray James Murray Splinter

Here are my scores, sorry its not an extensive review, but I'm getting a headache from thinking about this film. 2 Out of 10.

Ninja Turtles: The Next Mutation (1997-1998)

I wonder if this live action continuation of the films was the reason the 1987-1996 Animated Series was cancelled 6 episodes prior to Episode 200. I will admit, I didn't watch too much of this series, I watched maybe 5 episodes and one of them is a Power Rangers in Space episode(which is the only one they still air). I was a big Power Ranger fan, watching it from the beginning all the way to The Lost Galaxy(which came right after Power Rangers in Space)and even watched the later series Power Rangers: Dino Thunder, because it had Tommy Oliver(the original Green Ranger).

The series was a dumbed down version of what was already dumbed down in the series of films since part II. The female Turtle seemed to be an attempt to give the female audience someone to look up too(what happened to April). The Live Action and Voice Actors differ like in the films.


Gabe Khouth Michael Dobson Leonardo

Jareeed Blancard Kirby Morrow Michaelangelo

Ricard Yaw Jason Gray-Stanford Donatello

Mitchell A. Lee Yuen Matt Hill Raphael

Nicole Parker Lalainia Lindbjerg Venus de Milo

Fiona Scotty Stephen Mendel Splinter

Since I haven't seen enough of the series to give a definitive opinion, I will on the episodes I had seen. 3 out of 10.

Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles 2003 Animated Series

This new inception of the series started in 2003 and is still going strong. With already 143 episodes under its belt(with less amount of time on the air). This series has gone on to appease today's audiences while sticking true to the Mirage Comics. I have watched a few episodes and thought they were okay, but since I'm an 80's baby and had no idea up until recently its comic book origins, I stopped watching it(this went the same with the reboot of He-Man, yuck). So no review on this, I'm sorry, but from what I have seen, it is far better thsn the live action 3rd film and live action TV Series.

TMNT (2007)

I guess they couldn't come up with another title, like Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles IV, or Turtles IV: Back in Action. But this film is actually really good. When I first heard of it being a sequel and in CGI, I cringed. I saw Street Fighter II: The Animated Movie(which served as an animated sequel to the crap Street Fighter live action film). But I was pleasantly surprised at how good the film matched uo the original and even beat out parts 2 and 3(surprise there huh). The drawings of April and Casey are a bit annoying, as they look like they look like a fun house version of themselves. But other than that, the voice acting is great, the storyline is decent and the animation is stellar. So my score on this as I've only seen it once is 6 out of 10.

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