Episode 70


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Diana returns home to find an unwelcomed guest has laid waste to her sisters ("Paradise Lost"). Superman is forced into gladiatorial combat on a ruthless alien world ("War World"). And Grodd seeks to destroy both Gorilla and Central City ("The Brave and the Bold"). Also, Tom Deja phones in to set the duo straight about the Green Lantern Corps. [ 1:52:11 || 51.5 MB ]

The above is from: http://www.worldsfinestpodcast.com/episodes/wfp_070.mp3

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Guest DCAUFan1051

Maria Canals-Barrera who plays the voice of Hawkgirl is the mother on the Disney Channel show Wizards Of Waverly Place. I was shocked to find this out, but it's cool. I was like whoa what's Hawkgirl doing on the Disney channel.

Still listening will leave more thoughts later.

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There's a reuse of animation in, I believe, part 2 of Paradise Lost. In one of the fight scenes on Themyscra, the background behind the Flash changes from ancient Greek, to a lab of some sort while he's running, back to ancient Greek.

Mike's recap of War World is on my top 5 WFP moments list.

Grodd is my favorite Justice League villain.

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I was rewatching Paradise Lost - when the League first encounters Faust, Flash grabs the Gorgon talisman, dodges a bunch of energy balls, and charges at Faust - only to be tripped by a rock. Again. Anyways, just before Faust pulls up the rocks in his path, Flash is charging at the camera - with a room in the background, rather than the huge temple. There's a second or so of footage cut from "Speed Demons" (it's from when he jumps out of the hole Superman bored, and charges the Weather Wizard). Maybe they didn't like the original animation for Paradise Lost, or felt they needed to add a bit more in for flow.

I suppose it's a bit sad that I can tell exactly where a bit of Flash footage comes from...

Chris

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I'm surprised that no one mentioned the fact that SUPERMAN LOST A FIGHT TO WONDER WOMAN.

Now, granted, the second half of the fight was him trying not to hurt her because he knew who she was, but still.

Go re-watch Superman: The Animated Series. You'll be appalled by the amount of douchebags that get one over Supes!

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Go re-watch Superman: The Animated Series. You'll be appalled by the amount of douchebags that get one over Supes!

Well, yes, but that's a little different. He was in his own solo series, and they specifically had to make him weaker. Here, though, he's fighting another hero, and one that he should be able to bat away with a simple backhand.

In the DVD commentaries for Season 1, the creative team specifically mentions how they had Superman get pummeled all the time in Season 1 in order to show the danger that the various villains posed. (the line was "if ____ can knock down SUPERMAN, then he/she/it must be REALLY powerful")

But they quickly realized (after the end of Season 1) that they'd basically made Superman into a pansy, so they rectified it by starting Season 2 with "Twilight," where Superman goes all balls-out and nearly kills Darkseid.

Later in JLU, they rectify the S1 Supes/WW fight by having both characters fight Mongul, with WW getting the everloving crap kicked out of her and Supes being able to hold his own.

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Straight from the DCAU wiki page:

http://dcanimated.wikia.com/wiki/War_World

Production Inconsistencies

* It's never given a plausible explanation as to why War World's atmosphere debilitates J'onn's powers. It seems just a plot device.

* When J'onn is impersonating Mongul and can't keep it up he reverts back to his humanoid shape. Shouldn't he turn back to his original Martian shape?

James, did you post this on there?

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* When J'onn is impersonating Mongul and can't keep it up he reverts back to his humanoid shape. Shouldn't he turn back to his original Martian shape?

Y'know, I could swear that J'onn reverts to his "Earth Hero" form when attacked more than once. Eventually I just assumed that he made his hero form into his default form somehow.

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Straight from the DCAU wiki page:

http://dcanimated.wikia.com/wiki/War_World

Production Inconsistencies

* It's never given a plausible explanation as to why War World's atmosphere debilitates J'onn's powers. It seems just a plot device.

* When J'onn is impersonating Mongul and can't keep it up he reverts back to his humanoid shape. Shouldn't he turn back to his original Martian shape?

James, did you post this on there?

Negative.

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Go re-watch Superman: The Animated Series. You'll be appalled by the amount of douchebags that get one over Supes!

Well, yes, but that's a little different. He was in his own solo series, and they specifically had to make him weaker. Here, though, he's fighting another hero, and one that he should be able to bat away with a simple backhand.

I love Superman, don't get me wrong, but beating Diana with a "simple backhand?" Poppycock!

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Score another vote for Gladiator. I'm not a fan of Russell Crowe but have a lot of respect for his work.

Call me crazy but I'm not sure Mike's heart was in his War World review. Maybe I'm imagining things. I do sorta like Mongul in general though, I think he's a cut and paste villain who gets used in a lot of storylines just to put a familar face on some fresh plot, but sometimes he's used really well as we'll see in the JLU's Alan Moore adaptation For The Man Who Has Everything, which has to be one of the best episodes the show has to offer.

This sort of gladiatorial TV format has been around a while though, probably from Kirk fighting the Gorn in TOS episode Arena. Star Trek has repeated it often, from the shitty Voyager episode Tsunkatse where a certain My Dwayne Johnson made one his earliest acting appearances to the excellent DS9 episode In Purgatory's Shadow with Worf fighting in a Jem-Hadar prison camp. Its used again in Angel during season 1 ep The Ring. It really depends on how its used. In Angel it calls on the characters self-flagellation over his own past and the shift in that show from Buffy at the time to allow humans and demons to be equally good or bad. In DS9 it was part of a much bigger deal, with revelations about who the changelings replaced and more of a group prison break approach. War World was just the worst example of that particular recurring theme.

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* When J'onn is impersonating Mongul and can't keep it up he reverts back to his humanoid shape. Shouldn't he turn back to his original Martian shape?

Y'know, I could swear that J'onn reverts to his "Earth Hero" form when attacked more than once. Eventually I just assumed that he made his hero form into his default form somehow.

I'm not an expert on J'onn, so please correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe at one point in the comics, the spindly, more alien form was his private form, just for family. The more hybrid Earth/Mars form was the public form worn around other Martians. This could explain that if it weren't for the fact that we see the invaders attacking the more Martian form. Maybe they just landed at the "Sm'th Family Reunion" picnic.

A couple problems I had with part one of Paradise Lost: first, Mike mentioned that hurricanes take a while to build up. They were too accurate in the opening. There's this huge hurricane (about 2 minutes and 40 seconds) to see Diana save a girl, her mother's relieved, Diana's homesick. They could have done that in 60 seconds. The rest of that hurricane just seems like filler.

As to the discussion about 8 months, remember, that's not since the end of Secret Origins. That's since early in Part 2, when Diana leaves the island. We had discussed that the final scene in the Watchtower likely happened weeks or months after the invasion, giving time to make the final modifications on the satellite Wayne was probably already building for his deep space monitoring project.

Having just listened to your Wonder Woman review, and having read a lot of Greek Myths, it is a little frustrating to have Hades portrayed as a demonic villain. He is the god of the underworld. He's probably not the most fun at parties. He is not, however, evil or malicious (well, any more than any of the other Greek gods, all of whom operate on about a 5 year old's level of maturity and self-restraint). If anything, he interferes much less with mortals than many of the other gods.

I also noticed that when Faust was firing energy balls, at one point Batman and J'onn watch one go past and turn to watch it hit. Nice focus, guys.

I was glad you said something about Faust vs the Amazons, Mike. Hippolyta was a challenge to Hercules - it was frustrating that Faust seemed to manhandle her without much difficulty.

Chris

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As to the discussion about 8 months, remember, that's not since the end of Secret Origins. That's since early in Part 2, when Diana leaves the island. We had discussed that the final scene in the Watchtower likely happened weeks or months after the invasion, giving time to make the final modifications on the satellite Wayne was probably already building for his deep space monitoring project.

That's what I meant. In fact, didn't I say the timeline was "bullshit" because it had to have taken longer than eight months to have built the Watchtower?

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Gladiator has one of the most amazing opening scenes in film history, and is followed up by a pretty good movie. It doesn't live up to it but it isn't a bad film.

Watching some of these with my boys, I'm reminded why i just don't dig repeat viewings of this show. Why does Superman need to wear an oxygen mask underwater in Enemy Below? Why does he wear a space suit in Secret Origins (?). He's the biggest pussy in this show.

As far as the Hades is evil thing, he is very bitter about his lot in life even in mythology. Zeus got a lot of tail but never really raped any of his nieces as far as I know and Hades picked last as far as the male realms were doled out. He's never been happy with the Underworld.

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