Episode 75


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Guest DCAUFan1051

Continuity Aside I recently saw the mother may I ep james was talking about of TT... I hated it. I will be sticking with WFP through the TT era, but I doubt I'll ever own those DVD's

and Mike: Walking Tall is the only Rock film I can ever watch and like it.

Wow I never knew it was Bob the Goon that is awesome!!!

Just thought of this... the ghostly snakes = Kobra? I know not really but I just thought of it connecting Batman Beyond and JL.

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Guest DCAUFan1051

listening at the point where you guys are asking about them needing Grundy.

my thought in knowing that Rob Zombie voiced the villain was Grundy was a the living dead guy!

awesome banner on the mainpage too mike.

you Froze the wrong one!

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Guest dstroketheterminator

Congrats on 75 episodes Mike and James!

-Mike, While the show does have flaws I watch Smallville, I loved Absolute Justice. It has cool nods to the comics and we even see John Jones in martian form

-I think Black Mask or maybe Hush could work in the Nolan films, I agree that they should stick to the real world villains rather than the guys in tights

-Eclipsed is the worst episode of the 2nd season in my opinion

-James was right on with the Defenders comment, I think when the group returns in "Wake the Dead", Amazo could stand in for Silver Surfer

-Secret Society is okay, but not great. I just can't wait for next week for Hereafter,Wild Cards, and Comfort and Joy, the latter of which not includes a Swampthing cameo, but I wonder what Batman and Diana are doing all alone on the Watchtower :P .

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HAPPY 75TH EPISODE!!!

Speaking as a fellow atheist, I'm glad you two also connected to Hawkgirl in that faith does nothing for her either. Also glad your shared my gripe with the first one being just one big hero fight that didn't need to happen (though Clark hanging his head and sighing as Aquaman is lunging towards him before he knocks him out is priceless).

btw some of the noises made by that big black monster that Grundy fought in Ichthultu's brain were roars taken from the T. rex in the Jurassic Park.

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Guest dstroketheterminator

I don't want to get into the religion thing, I go to church on Christmas and Easter. That's it. And I only go to please my family. I personally am atheist, but I can let other keep their beliefs. BTW Mike and James, when you start Teen Titans will you be reviewing Trouble in Tokyo and the Lost Episode? I believe it is continuity due to Nightwing, Speedy, the Flash stuff, ect. I say before you review the 1st episode you state the reasons it's in continuity as one last fuck you to these naysayers My link. Also, I know you guys, James at least use the DCAU wiki for references. As Teen Titans is not covered there, I feel it is my duty to direct you to a Teen Titans WIki

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Whoa whoa whoa I can take all the gripes, but I cannot accept the gripes with the final fight. I think it's possibly the best group fight so far because it's not so staged and clean and everyone is perfectly paired off and all that. It is chaotic, people are constantly moving in and out of frame, there is no clear focus, and it's insanely frantic. It's one of the closest JL gets to TT style group fights and it's possibly my favorite thing about the episode.

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Guest dstroketheterminator

When you guys were talking about the TT episode with Red X, the race, and Robin's briefcase, I have come to the conclusion the secret inside is proof TT is in the DCAU :P

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Whoa whoa whoa I can take all the gripes, but I cannot accept the gripes with the final fight. I think it's possibly the best group fight so far because it's not so staged and clean and everyone is perfectly paired off and all that. It is chaotic, people are constantly moving in and out of frame, there is no clear focus, and it's insanely frantic. It's one of the closest JL gets to TT style group fights and it's possibly my favorite thing about the episode.

Look at the way it's animated. Compared to other DCAU / Justice League fights, it's sloppy.

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Guest dstroketheterminator

Now that I think about it, with all the TT villains talk, I just noticed that each individual Titan has their own foil, and has a season based around them:

Robin=Deathstroke

Cyborg=Brother Blood

Beast Boy= The Brain

Raven=Trigon

Starfire= She doesn't really have an arch foe, but there is a season where she gets lots of character development,mostly in season 3, with her arranged marriage, Silkie, ect.

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Guest dstroketheterminator

Mike, you're right,I looked at my DVD, and the guy at the end of spider-man 2 does look a lot like Thomas Jane's Punisher. Here is a crappy youtube quality screencap, maybe someone with Blu-Ray could take a better one to compare it with.

punisher-thomas-jane.jpg

punisher.png

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Whoa whoa whoa I can take all the gripes, but I cannot accept the gripes with the final fight. I think it's possibly the best group fight so far because it's not so staged and clean and everyone is perfectly paired off and all that. It is chaotic, people are constantly moving in and out of frame, there is no clear focus, and it's insanely frantic. It's one of the closest JL gets to TT style group fights and it's possibly my favorite thing about the episode.

Look at the way it's animated. Compared to other DCAU / Justice League fights, it's sloppy.

Well I haven't seen this episode in a while (but I've seen it several times), but given that the first season of JL is the poorest, blocky, clunky, most sloppily animated thing in the DCAU I'm hard-pressed to believe that the climactic fight of Secret Society, which is insanely fast, kinetic, and as I recall fluid, is worse.

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As usual, only got part way through in the car on the way to work, bat a couple thoughts:

First, about Glorious Godfrey - he's actually a Apokolipsian (?) villain with the power of persuasion. He was sent to Earth by Darkseid during the "Legends" miniseries right after the original Crisis to destroy faith in heroes, both by the public and in the minds of the heroes themselves (Billy Batson in particular was really doubting himself). The miniseries both established Wally West as the new Flash, and introduced Diana to many of the other DC heroes. Godfrey fried his brain when he realized that just grabbing Fate's helmet and putting it on his own head was Not A Good Idea.

The ancient humans fell victim to one of the classic blunders. (I've been noticing this about the denari in the Dresden Files as well). This object will possess anyone who touches it. We will a) raise a temple to draw attention to it, b) bury it as deeply as possible, or c) tie it to a rock and drop it in the Marianas Trench. Lord, what fools these mortals be.

About Flash's light - I thought that when J'onn turned out the lights, he just destroyed the cables in that room. As to the light itself, could it have been a view port into the Watchtower's fusion generator?

As to GL putting the ramp out in from of Flash, the usual explanation is that ring projections are "hard light" and do move at lightspeed. (Larry Niven, in Ganthet's Tale, used this in a typical hard sci-fi way. Hal Jordan flew away from someone using a Green Lantern ring at near lightspeed and fired behind him. His speed red-shifted the beam, meaning that by the time it hit the other ring-user, it had shifted to yellow). Flash's comment to Sinestro was that although the ring could move that fast, Sinestro couldn't react t Flash's activity fast enough. That's not happening in Eclipsed, though. John tells the ring to make a walkway towards the sun as fast as possible. Flash then follows the walkway - he's responding to John, rather than the other way around, so John doesn't need to react fast enough to keep up with Flash.

I only got as far as Mike's summary of Terror. One thing I noticed, though, is that in "Paradise Lost" the pieces of the key were scattered to the "ends of the earth" which is apparently an American museum, an American mall, and a South American pyramid. Fate at least scattered combatants more evenly - Salem, Massachusetts, Egypt, and Rapa Nui aren't exactly evenly spread out, but they're a lot closer to it than some.

Chris

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First, about Glorious Godfrey - he's actually a Apokolipsian (?) villain with the power of persuasion. He was sent to Earth by Darkseid during the "Legends" miniseries right after the original Crisis to destroy faith in heroes, both by the public and in the minds of the heroes themselves (Billy Batson in particular was really doubting himself). The miniseries both established Wally West as the new Flash, and introduced Diana to many of the other DC heroes. Godfrey fried his brain when he realized that just grabbing Fate's helmet and putting it on his own head was Not A Good Idea.

Problem is, the episode never touches upon that.

About Flash's light - I thought that when J'onn turned out the lights, he just destroyed the cables in that room. As to the light itself, could it have been a view port into the Watchtower's fusion generator?

The entire Watchtower went dark, though.

As to GL putting the ramp out in from of Flash, the usual explanation is that ring projections are "hard light" and do move at lightspeed. (Larry Niven, in Ganthet's Tale, used this in a typical hard sci-fi way. Hal Jordan flew away from someone using a Green Lantern ring at near lightspeed and fired behind him. His speed red-shifted the beam, meaning that by the time it hit the other ring-user, it had shifted to yellow). Flash's comment to Sinestro was that although the ring could move that fast, Sinestro couldn't react t Flash's activity fast enough. That's not happening in Eclipsed, though. John tells the ring to make a walkway towards the sun as fast as possible. Flash then follows the walkway - he's responding to John, rather than the other way around, so John doesn't need to react fast enough to keep up with Flash.

Ah, okay. But still, the sun is 90 million miles from the Earth. I just can't buy John being able to send a projection that far.

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Ah, okay. But still, the sun is 90 million miles from the Earth. I just can't buy John being able to send a projection that far.

This was an email that I was going to send in, but hey, what the heck, I'll post it here:

*ahem*

This is a list of reasons why your technical analysis of Flash and GL's plan is wrong.

#1: The warp drive would melt? Why's that? There are definitely metals in the DCU that can survive contact with the sun. Like, say, METALLO? The substance which can survive Superman's heat vision? (which, if you think about it, is probably about as hot as the sun's surface, considering how fast it melts through metal) And hey, for that matter, in the DCAU, we have cops with laser guns and superheroes with WARP DRIVES. I mean, really. Why couldn't that kind of tech, which can literally BEND spacetime, be possibly made of metal that can survive the sun's heat?

#2: Yes, the comment is made that Sinestro can't think faster than Flash can run, but that doesn't mean that John couldn't make a construct that that's faster than Flash. A power ring serves to interpret and follow its wielder's commands; the constructs aren't literally thoughts put into energy form. They're fueled by willpower, but that's different. A ring-wielder can't input commands through the ring faster than the Flash can move, but all John had to do was think "really long platform" and the ring did all the work itself. It was a totally different situation from the fight with Sinestro, wherein Sinestro had to actually outmaneuver Flash. Ring constructs—being light and all—are actually generated at lightspeed (as Sinestro says), which is *faster* than Flash was running.

#3: Yes, a green lantern ring can generate enough power to create a platform from here to the Sun. It's not actually the size that matters; it's the power output. All John was doing was providing friction for the Flash as he ran; that's not a lot of power. Heck, it might have even been a "reactive" construct, where it only put out solid force when Flash stepped on it.

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The Terror Beyond is poor plot-wise but the emotion is very well done. Mike, Grundy died in this and you know he pops up again. Do you honestly think they'd ignore a major plot point like that within the JL series? Its not like Clayface between Batman and JL, he easily could have been stabilised before they imprisoned him. Grundy's return will not ignore the events of this story.

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First, about Glorious Godfrey - he's actually a Apokolipsian (?) villain with the power of persuasion. He was sent to Earth by Darkseid during the "Legends" miniseries right after the original Crisis to destroy faith in heroes, both by the public and in the minds of the heroes themselves (Billy Batson in particular was really doubting himself). The miniseries both established Wally West as the new Flash, and introduced Diana to many of the other DC heroes. Godfrey fried his brain when he realized that just grabbing Fate's helmet and putting it on his own head was Not A Good Idea.

Problem is, the episode never touches upon that.

Naturally, not a European swallow. I agree with you there.

I was just bringing up that discrediting superheroes via public opinion was the sort of thing he did in Legends, so it was another reference. That said, happy as I am with any Flash-centric episode, I agree completely that the Godfrey subplot (if that's not giving it too much credit) didn't add a thing (other than "And what's WRONG with the way I dress?!?"). If anything, the fact that his comics version was a minion of Darkseid may actually be a check against the episode - they took a Darkseid plot and jobbed it into meaningless filler.

Speaking of references, the guy who wrote "The Seduction Of The Innocent was Dr. Fredric Wertham (in the episode it was by Dr. Fredric). Barry Allen built the cosmic treadmill, and was the main one to use it. Wally West used it as Kid Flash, but is fast enough now that he usuallycan bounce around the timestream without it. It was used by Hunter Zolomon to try to go back is time and change his biggest mistake; it exploded, turning him into Zoom, the latest Reverse Flash.

Chris

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