KnightWing Posted June 1, 2011 Report Share Posted June 1, 2011 Ultimates worked really well for the first couple years. It only went off the rails when it tried to be too "different" for the sake of being different. What DC needs to be careful of is staying true to the core of the characters. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Delete Posted June 1, 2011 Report Share Posted June 1, 2011 The more I think about this the more horrible of an idea this becomes to me. To reboot the universe you have to jettison a ton of popular characters and in comic books no popular, or even unpopular characters stay gone. So we'll be rehashing a ton of old stories that have been told repeatedly already. We'll have to sit through Dick Grayson going from Robin to Nightwing for the 9,723rd time. Sinestro will have to turn on Hal Jordan again. Coast City will have to be destroyed so Hal can become Parallax and Kyle can be reintroduced. And they'll claim it is a brand new origin and and brand new story when in reality the only difference is that Cyborg Superman will have an iPad or something. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
prez Posted June 1, 2011 Report Share Posted June 1, 2011 With not much of an effort, this could honestly push me out of comics entirely. And I'm not even exaggerating. I can barely afford what I get right now trade-waiting and DC is basically all I read. If this is as destructive as it appears, why would I even read anymore? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Missy Posted June 1, 2011 Report Share Posted June 1, 2011 I posted this on Tom Deja's Facebook page earlier today: I don't care about them rebooting continuity; I think it will last a year (if that) then will revert back to the old universe, much like Age of Apocalypse. What I do care about, however, is the renumbering of Action and Detective Comics. There's a rich history there; how many mainstream magazines have been around since 1938? DC is erasing their legacy for what? A short-term bump in sales, that's what. What DC should do post-Flashpoint is keep Action and Detective Comics going as they always have, but scatter all of the other heroes across the multiverse. This would leave Superman and Batman as the only heroes on the core DC Earth, while everyone else is stuck on worlds they hardly know, and might be hostile to them. Some could remember their pasts, and others might not. Either way, nothing would be erased, characters would be rejuvenated, there would be the opportunity for "brand-new and fresh" stories, and even the core universe with Superman and Batman would be a very dangerous and unfamiliar place for our lone heroes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stavros Posted June 1, 2011 Report Share Posted June 1, 2011 To be honest I'm utterly done with the DC multiverse and I'm looking for them to start telling new kinds of stories as their big events. Blackest Night was a good attempt, even if I wasn't really sold on it overall. Marvel's events consistently bring forth narrative elements that were already there and comes together in a big event that feels different every time. Disassembled, Civil War, World War Hulk, Secret Invasion, Siege, Fear Itself. All different, picking on elements of a thread but each it's own thing. Why is it when DC tries to do anything outside of a Crisis or a GL story we get shit like Cry For Justice? I like the idea of Flash being the focal point for a story, and I'm open minded about Flashpoint even if it is elseworlds in all but name, but DC needs to start being more creative than just hitting a big reset button. That's like One More Daying every single character they have. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dread Posted June 1, 2011 Report Share Posted June 1, 2011 See I do disagree with rebooting continuity. I wouldn't mind if they hadn't put so much fucking effort into doing it within the confines of continuity over the past five to ten years. They've done an admirable job making DC a universe, THE universe that I want to read. Now, not so much. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Missy Posted June 1, 2011 Report Share Posted June 1, 2011 Since I haven't been following along as they've essentially rebuilt their universe these past few years, I think that's why I don't mind the idea of a reboot. That said, I do see why it's pissing a lot of people off, especially people such as yourself, Des, who've been watching DC build and build and build each and every month. The idea that they're going to tear it all down has to be infuriating. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KnightWing Posted June 1, 2011 Report Share Posted June 1, 2011 I will wait to be infuriated until I see exactly what changes they're making, and how they'll play out. Until then, I'll stay optimistic. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dc20willsave Posted June 1, 2011 Author Report Share Posted June 1, 2011 It's coming from Rich Johnson so I'm taking it was a grain of salt but we're getting a Batgirl #1 and Nightwing #1 in September with Barbara Gordon as Batgirl. Excuse me while I look over Marvel's catalog to see what I'm going to start picking up in September if all this is true. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SuaveStar Posted June 1, 2011 Report Share Posted June 1, 2011 It's coming from Rich Johnson so I'm taking it was a grain of salt but we're getting a Batgirl #1 and Nightwing #1 in September with Barbara Gordon as Batgirl. Excuse me while I look over Marvel's catalog to see what I'm going to start picking up in September if all this is true. The more I hear about these changes, and the less angry I get, and the more indifferent I become about the whole thing. I might get some of the books come September, but, right now, with each story coming out, I feel a little less bothered with what is going on with DC. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dan Posted June 1, 2011 Report Share Posted June 1, 2011 I'm not saying they're equally important or wildly similar, but this reboot doesn't strike me as being totally different from the post-Crisis reboot of the late '80s. Lost of titles were renumbered Wonder Woman, Flash and JL come to mind), the previous history was completely wiped away, and the company started largely fresh. Now, granted, back then DC didn't have to listen to the internet fanboy hivemind screaming its nerdrage 24/7, and comics were still laregly for kids then, so they managed to stick to their guns and keep the direction going, something I seriously doubt would happen here. And I'm not for one instant saying I like the idea of what they're doing now; just saying they've done something like it before. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
prez Posted June 1, 2011 Report Share Posted June 1, 2011 Andy Diggle just retweeted my response to his post: "Anything that gets more kids reading comics is a good thing. Marvel & DC superheroes were *created* for kids." My response: "So to get more kids reading comics, you're cool with alienating the readers who have read their entire lives?" No comment or anything, which has just led to idiots mocking me. I love Internet discussions. Twitter has truly changed our lives for the better. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Missy Posted June 1, 2011 Report Share Posted June 1, 2011 I'm not saying they're equally important or wildly similar, but this reboot doesn't strike me as being totally different from the post-Crisis reboot of the late '80s. Lost of titles were renumbered Wonder Woman, Flash and JL come to mind), the previous history was completely wiped away, and the company started largely fresh. Now, granted, back then DC didn't have to listen to the internet fanboy hivemind screaming its nerdrage 24/7, and comics were still laregly for kids then, so they managed to stick to their guns and keep the direction going, something I seriously doubt would happen here. And I'm not for one instant saying I like the idea of what they're doing now; just saying they've done something like it before. How dare you make perfectly rational sense while citing previous examples! You, sir, fail at being a comic book fanboy! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stavros Posted June 1, 2011 Report Share Posted June 1, 2011 I'm not saying they're equally important or wildly similar, but this reboot doesn't strike me as being totally different from the post-Crisis reboot of the late '80s. Lost of titles were renumbered Wonder Woman, Flash and JL come to mind), the previous history was completely wiped away, and the company started largely fresh. Now, granted, back then DC didn't have to listen to the internet fanboy hivemind screaming its nerdrage 24/7, and comics were still laregly for kids then, so they managed to stick to their guns and keep the direction going, something I seriously doubt would happen here. And I'm not for one instant saying I like the idea of what they're doing now; just saying they've done something like it before. How dare you make perfectly rational sense while citing previous examples! You, sir, fail at being a comic book fanboy! Damn, if Dan doesn't make it all sound ok. I'll quibble though, since the post-crisis continuity is much closer interwoven than prior to those events. Plus as you say, since it was kids without the internet the fan backlash was always going to be minuscule compared, heck I doubt most readers even thought about critiquing the company. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Venneh Posted June 1, 2011 Report Share Posted June 1, 2011 Huh. I wasn't around for it, so I've never had to deal with it. Maybe it will be okay after all. Silly old man rationality. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Koete Posted June 1, 2011 Report Share Posted June 1, 2011 Like most cases where they relaunch with a #1 issue, I'm sure there will be increases in sales for many of the titles. The real question is how much of that increase will be retained, if at all. Andy Diggle just retweeted my response to his post: "Anything that gets more kids reading comics is a good thing. Marvel & DC superheroes were *created* for kids." As far as a reboot getting kids and new readers into comics, comics being accessible is certainly a factor, but I don't think it's the most important. Without awareness that comics exist, how are you going to get new readers? The digital plan is a good step at getting comics out of obscure comic shops, but there's still a lot to do if a real effort wants to be made. I think diversifying the line beyond superheroes is a smart choice as well. Even so, with comics costing $2.99-3.99, I see very few kids being able to get into the hobby. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Delete Posted June 1, 2011 Report Share Posted June 1, 2011 It's coming from Rich Johnson so I'm taking it was a grain of salt but we're getting a Batgirl #1 and Nightwing #1 in September with Barbara Gordon as Batgirl. So Damian never existed now Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stavros Posted June 1, 2011 Report Share Posted June 1, 2011 I wonder if we'll all vote to kill off Jason Todd again? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Koete Posted June 1, 2011 Report Share Posted June 1, 2011 It's coming from Rich Johnson so I'm taking it was a grain of salt but we're getting a Batgirl #1 and Nightwing #1 in September with Barbara Gordon as Batgirl. So Damian never existed now I have no idea how you came to that conclusion from that link. Anyway, retailer Brian Hibbs' initial thoughts on the reboot. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Delete Posted June 1, 2011 Report Share Posted June 1, 2011 It's coming from Rich Johnson so I'm taking it was a grain of salt but we're getting a Batgirl #1 and Nightwing #1 in September with Barbara Gordon as Batgirl. So Damian never existed now I have no idea how you came to that conclusion from that link. Anyway, retailer Brian Hibbs' initial thoughts on the reboot. They are rebooting things to a point where Barbara Gordon was not shot, and Dick Grayson just had his falling out with Batman. Not sure where Damian fits in there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Koete Posted June 1, 2011 Report Share Posted June 1, 2011 They are rebooting things to a point where Barbara Gordon was not shot, and Dick Grayson just had his falling out with Batman. Not sure where Damian fits in there. That's speculation on what will happen, not fact, as the books haven't even been solicited yet. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stavros Posted June 1, 2011 Report Share Posted June 1, 2011 Does this mean we get old school Teen Titans? Afro Cyborg and Donna Troy marrying the creepily old man? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Missy Posted June 1, 2011 Report Share Posted June 1, 2011 Cyborg is in the Justice League promo image, so I doubt he's with the Teen Titans. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KnightWing Posted June 2, 2011 Report Share Posted June 2, 2011 Cyborg is in the Justice League promo image, so I doubt he's with the Teen Titans. I'm wondering if that's an end-of-Flashpoint image, rather than just a straight-up Justice League image. The comparison to the Post-Crisis reboot is apt. And, like my Man of Steel #1 avatar might suggest, I absolutely loved what they did there. Rebooting DC continuity made a ton of fans mad as hell in the 80s, but DC came back stronger than ever, and has been all the better for it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SuaveStar Posted June 2, 2011 Report Share Posted June 2, 2011 I'm wondering if that's an end-of-Flashpoint image, rather than just a straight-up Justice League image. DC's Source are calling it the cover from Justice League #1 Also, I just noticed, the yellow oval is gone from Bruce Wayne Batman. I find that interesting that the ovals return didn't even last a year. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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