Venneh Posted June 8, 2009 Report Share Posted June 8, 2009 The first Spidey was a solid film. The second Spidey was goddamn amazing. They started me on my path to geekdom. Hm. I should watch those again soon. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SuaveStar Posted June 8, 2009 Report Share Posted June 8, 2009 It was solid film, but it was just there, it wasn't special and after seeing 2 you could say Raimi was just trying to find where the line was and what he could do. Two was like a sequel should be, he raised the bar, and learned from the first movie. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Koete Posted June 8, 2009 Report Share Posted June 8, 2009 I prefer the first over the second, but fully admit that the second is superior on an objective level. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slothian Posted June 8, 2009 Report Share Posted June 8, 2009 The first was a very good origins film, the second was just a very good film in general. The third......yeah..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Delete Posted June 8, 2009 Report Share Posted June 8, 2009 Five words: The first two spidermen movies. Spider-Man 2, sure, but I was underwhelmed by the first one. I liked the first one better than the second myself. but as I indicated in my earlier post I was not a big fan of either of them really. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KnightWing Posted June 9, 2009 Report Share Posted June 9, 2009 I loved the first one as a kid, but in recent years Tobey Maguire has come to ANNOY THE PISS OUT OF ME. The second one is a great movie, though I don't really like watching it anymore because most of the film is Peter getting repeatedly raped by how terrible his life is. (but not in a funny way like in the comics) Amazing characterization, dialogue, and action, though. The third... well, the first time I saw it was the day after my terrible senior prom in which I was backstabbed by my best friend and rejected by a girl, so that may have altered my emotional state. But I'm pretty sure that it sucked. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Molly Posted June 9, 2009 Report Share Posted June 9, 2009 But I'm pretty sure that it sucked. It totally did, despite Thomas Hayden Church and Eric Foreman's best efforts. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Koete Posted June 9, 2009 Report Share Posted June 9, 2009 I think if Red had been in it, it would be remembered in a more positive light. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SuaveStar Posted June 9, 2009 Report Share Posted June 9, 2009 I think if Red had been in it, it would be remembered in a more positive light. Wel he would have kicked Spiderman's ass. They should have done more in three with Eddie Brock and not just suddenly have him a homicidal maniac. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KnightWing Posted June 9, 2009 Report Share Posted June 9, 2009 They should have done more in three with Eddie Brock and not just suddenly have him a homicidal maniac. Well, from what I understand about SM3's filming, Raimi had almost no creative control over the film. If Raimi had had his way, Venom likely wouldn't have been in there at all. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dread Posted June 9, 2009 Report Share Posted June 9, 2009 True, but he certainly didn't make the best of the situation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Molly Posted June 9, 2009 Report Share Posted June 9, 2009 And the movie black suit was fucking awful. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dread Posted June 9, 2009 Report Share Posted June 9, 2009 And he wrote the script. If he was so against it, why was he so instrumental in it sucking? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KnightWing Posted June 9, 2009 Report Share Posted June 9, 2009 True, but he certainly didn't make the best of the situation. I think he did. The story had WAY too many plot points, but at least the narrative actually flowed nicely. And he wrote the script. If he was so against it, why was he so instrumental in it sucking? Technically he wrote the script, but he was given certain "orders" when writing it. Things like "You must have A, B, C, and D in this movie." He had to figure out how to craft a narrative out of Venom, Sandman, Harry, MJ, Gwen, Dr. Connors, and everything else. (though I'm not a fan of the script either, to be honest. I just think that the actual story points were the worst element.) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dread Posted June 9, 2009 Report Share Posted June 9, 2009 To be fair, Sandman was neither A,B,C or D. He wanted him in there and he put him in there. When you make a big studio movie you make the movie they want you to make. He did a bad job. There are six million screenwriters in LA who could have made that work. Harry, Venom and Spidey with MJ and Gwen in the mix could be a great movie, a classic even. It was not even passable. Add in the retconning of Sandman killing UNcle Ben and you have one of the worst superhero movies since Superman IV: The Quest for Peace. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SuaveStar Posted June 9, 2009 Report Share Posted June 9, 2009 Harsh words. But yeah, he had the script and he could've moved stuff about and actually made a solid narrative. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dread Posted June 9, 2009 Report Share Posted June 9, 2009 I just get a little flustered when someone blames a movie that was written, directed and essentially edited by the same guy on the corporate suits. Yeah, they meddled. That's what they do. That's how Hollywood works. Try reading a screenplay sometime. Any one. You won't find one that goes unchanged from script to screen. If Raimi had been locked out of the editing suite or taken his name off of the film, that would be an entirely different matter. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Molly Posted June 9, 2009 Report Share Posted June 9, 2009 As the biggest Raimi fanboy here, I'm not gonna try and defend him. Spider-Man 3 was a rare miss. But worst since Superman IV? Seriously? Daredevil, Elektra, The Fantastic Four Movies, and Batman and fucking Robin, would all *easily* trump it. Gross exaggeration. Biggest disappointment? Sure. Worst film? No way. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dread Posted June 9, 2009 Report Share Posted June 9, 2009 Daredevil was miles better than SM3. Even the theatrical version. Ok, you got me on Elektra and B&R but "rare miss" isn't a defense. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dread Posted June 9, 2009 Report Share Posted June 9, 2009 As Brother D, the biggest Raimi fanboy I know, so eloquently puts it in a voicemail for the next episode of Dread Media, "Raimi is a dabbler." I have to agree and think that he's made one too many horror films just like he's made one too many superhero films. He doesn't love horror or Spider-Man, he loves the Three Stooges. He should try and remember to not throw that into everyhting he does when it isn't fitting. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SuaveStar Posted June 9, 2009 Report Share Posted June 9, 2009 Look was Sm3 a commercial success? Yes. Was it a critical success? No. Most of those movies mentioned(F4 made money, for some reason....) were big failures for the companys that funded them. Is Raimi to blame for the movie being a gigantic cluster, yes, he could have set up four by having Venom commit attacks and get away, not be fucking killed off. That's the biggest annoyance I have, they kill off one hero, one villian and one gets let to go off into space, what in the fuck. It always annoys me how the villian usually dies at the end of superhero movies. He is a big Stooges fan, and can do the comedy, I just wished he would do a straight up comedy, not make Peter Parker an unlikable wife beating prick, who we are then meant to side for rather than, the villians who have been hard done by! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dread Posted June 9, 2009 Report Share Posted June 9, 2009 Look was Sm3 a commercial success? Yes. Was it a critical success? No. Most of those movies mentioned(F4 made money, for some reason....) were big failures for the companys that funded them. Out of that list, I'm pretty sure that only Elektra was a failure at the Box Office. Even that had a 43 Million budget and ended up with 57 worldwide. Batman and Robin budgeted 125 million and ended up with more than 240 million. Daredevil budgeted 78 and broke two hundred million. Not SM level success but far from bombs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Molly Posted June 9, 2009 Report Share Posted June 9, 2009 Even Scorsese has made a bad movie, is all I'm saying. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dread Posted June 9, 2009 Report Share Posted June 9, 2009 Even Scorsese has made a bad movie, is all I'm saying. But have any of Raimi's measured up to one of Scorcese's mid-level films? Hardly. Orson Welles, Stanley Kubrick, Francis Ford Coppola and Spielberg have all made at least one bad movie too. Not one of them as bad as SM 3, mind you. Look, Raimi, for me anyway, will always be forgiven for anythign he does for the simple fact of Evil Dead 2 and Darkman alone. But it's not to say I'm going to spend any more money on him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Molly Posted June 9, 2009 Report Share Posted June 9, 2009 I'm not comparing Raimi to Scorsese, but it's not like he sat down and said "Let's make this thing really suck!" the pieces didn't come together as he had envisioned them. Following up Spider-Man 2, which was the best damn comic book adaptation to it's release date, was no small task and the guy got overzealous. I think he more than deserves a chance to do some good with Spider-Man 4. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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