prez Posted January 20, 2009 Report Share Posted January 20, 2009 Maybe I worded that badly. It's certainly true that Marvel is the one that hop-scotches from big event to big event. What bothers me about the DC events is that you can't understand what's going on unless you read every related book. DC hasn't had an event since Infinite Crisis? Dude, seriously? "Countdown," "One Year Later" and "52" weren't events? "Death of the New Gods"? "Salvation Run"? All DC is these days is inter-locking events and endless plotlines. The difference with Marvel is that their big events can (usually) be contained in one series and you can read other books if you choose. I read only "Secret Invasion" yet I never felt lost in the story. "Civil War" was a bit worse, but I still followed the plot easily. Maybe that's just my reading. As for the deaths, it is true that Marvel is the king of killing people and bringing them back. But it seems to me that until this year, with Cap, they've mostly stayed away from the iconic characters. Meanwhile, DC has killed every one of their major characters now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dread Posted January 20, 2009 Author Report Share Posted January 20, 2009 This might take a while... Maybe I worded that badly. It's certainly true that Marvel is the one that hop-scotches from big event to big event. What bothers me about the DC events is that you can't understand what's going on unless you read every related book. DC hasn't had an event since Infinite Crisis? Dude, seriously? "Countdown," "One Year Later" and "52" weren't events? "Death of the New Gods"? "Salvation Run"? All DC is these days is inter-locking events and endless plotlines. Countdown was a weekly series of stuff going on that was only barely and rarely touched on in the regular universe. Not an event and neither was 52. They were self-contained. As was Death of the New Gods and Salvation Run. Is Secret Six an event? Come on. One Year Later is the only thing there I can see an argument for. But seeing as it was more of a company wide movement and a creative experiment than anything. It wasn't a story. The difference with Marvel is that their big events can (usually) be contained in one series and you can read other books if you choose. I read only "Secret Invasion" yet I never felt lost in the story. "Civil War" was a bit worse, but I still followed the plot easily. Maybe that's just my reading. I am astonished. None of the emotional impact is in SI. You HAD to read the Avengers books to get anywhere near the whole story. Or a story for that matter. You're right. Civil War was a bit worse. At least SI ended in SI. The ending of Civil War was Captain America #25 and I cannot be convinced otherwise. Plus, you only really had to read Civil War Confessions to get the whole story. As for the deaths, it is true that Marvel is the king of killing people and bringing them back. But it seems to me that until this year, with Cap, they've mostly stayed away from the iconic characters. Meanwhile, DC has killed every one of their major characters now. No, but they clone them. What's the point? Charles Xavier, Jean Grey, Colossus, Kitty Pryde, there's hardly an X-Man who hasn't died and other than Spidey, there aren't any bigger guns than the X-Men. The whole team died at one point. As far as death goes in the Marvel U, they prefer their deaths to affect their heroes rather than have their heroes die. They like the girl in the fridge theory. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
prez Posted January 20, 2009 Report Share Posted January 20, 2009 As for the deaths, it is true that Marvel is the king of killing people and bringing them back. But it seems to me that until this year, with Cap, they've mostly stayed away from the iconic characters. Meanwhile, DC has killed every one of their major characters now. No, but they clone them. What's the point? Charles Xavier, Jean Grey, Colossus, Kitty Pryde, there's hardly an X-Man who hasn't died and other than Spidey, there aren't any bigger guns than the X-Men. The whole team died at one point. As far as death goes in the Marvel U, they prefer their deaths to affect their heroes rather than have their heroes die. They like the girl in the fridge theory. I wasn't really counting the X-Men. Honestly, that book is so screwed up I can't even fathom it. Maybe I'm old school, but to me the Marvel big guns are the original Avengers, the FF and Spidey. FF killed Reed forever ago, and the Avengers killed B-listers (and I'm counting Jan in that), but other than that the big guys are usually let alone. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Molly Posted January 20, 2009 Report Share Posted January 20, 2009 original Avengers, the FF and Spidey. And they killed the Thing in around 2001. Iron Man was "killed" right before the Teen Tony crap. Thor *just* came back. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
prez Posted January 20, 2009 Report Share Posted January 20, 2009 I forgot about the Thing's death. And Iron Man. And I wasn't thinking of Thor as 'dead' - just away somewhere. So maybe forget what I said about the deaths part. ... ... Shut up, Preston! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SuaveStar Posted January 20, 2009 Report Share Posted January 20, 2009 I may not get half of whats going on in final crisis as, well it's me. But, I am really enjoying it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Molly Posted January 21, 2009 Report Share Posted January 21, 2009 Shut up, Preston! Missed you too, Prez. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
James D. Posted January 21, 2009 Report Share Posted January 21, 2009 Out of morbid curiosity I bought Final Crisis #6...... Seriously? Double you tee eff. However, I am intrigued at the apparent "I Am Batman" story arc. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Delete Posted January 28, 2009 Report Share Posted January 28, 2009 Just read the last issue. Just watned to say how much I like Lois Lane's narration of the story. Other than that I'll just wait for people to figure out how they feel about how this ended. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SuaveStar Posted January 28, 2009 Report Share Posted January 28, 2009 Will be picking this up either tomorrow or friday, Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Koete Posted January 28, 2009 Report Share Posted January 28, 2009 I loved issue #7. Final Crisis has been the best modern event comic I've read. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dread Posted January 29, 2009 Author Report Share Posted January 29, 2009 Ummm...whoa. I'm not sure I get it. I loved it but I'm not sure I get it. Goosebumps 4 times in forty pages. What the hell are they going to do now? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Koete Posted January 29, 2009 Report Share Posted January 29, 2009 Ummm...whoa. I'm not sure I get it. I loved it but I'm not sure I get it. Goosebumps 4 times in forty pages. What the hell are they going to do now? I have no idea. All I know is that I want more Morrison in the DCU. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stavros Posted January 29, 2009 Report Share Posted January 29, 2009 Wait, what? I've read this thing and I'm still not sure how it ended. Statler: That was a real wire act. Waldorf: In this book, everything's a wire act. Statler: Why's that? Waldorf: Because, you keep asking "Wire they doing it?" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Delete Posted January 29, 2009 Report Share Posted January 29, 2009 Wait, what? I've read this thing and I'm still not sure how it ended. Statler: That was a real wire act. Waldorf: In this book, everything's a wire act. Statler: Why's that? Waldorf: Because, you keep asking "Wire they doing it?" Well Final Crisis started with Metron teaching a DC caveman character Anthro how to use fire. At the end you see Bruce Wayne drawing Bats on a cave wall as Antro dies next to him of old age. Now if I was Bruce I just would just write, hey Flash can you run your ass real fast through time to pick me up. But it's Bruce so I give him the benefit of the doubt. Maybe he likes the Cromagnon people. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dread Posted January 29, 2009 Author Report Share Posted January 29, 2009 Well Final Crisis started with Metron teaching a DC caveman character Anthro how to use fire. At the end you see Bruce Wayne drawing Bats on a cave wall as Antro dies next to him of old age. Now if I was Bruce I just would just write, hey Flash can you run your ass real fast through time to pick me up. But it's Bruce so I give him the benefit of the doubt. Maybe he likes the Cromagnon people. Or he has Metron's chair and is biding his time. I'm going to reread this asap but I have to buy #2 again. I can't find it. I don't mind because it was good. Unlike another event I can think of. Edit: Or he IS Metron now. My brain hurts. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Missy Posted January 29, 2009 Report Share Posted January 29, 2009 For a long time now it's been rumored that Bruce would become a New God, so he might be Metron. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stavros Posted January 29, 2009 Report Share Posted January 29, 2009 Well Final Crisis started with Metron teaching a DC caveman character Anthro how to use fire. At the end you see Bruce Wayne drawing Bats on a cave wall as Antro dies next to him of old age. Now if I was Bruce I just would just write, hey Flash can you run your ass real fast through time to pick me up. But it's Bruce so I give him the benefit of the doubt. Maybe he likes the Cromagnon people. Actually I got that bit fine. Its just its all a bit like- Bad Guy- "You cannot defeat me, for I have mastered all time and space in an unspecific way!" Good Guy- "I'm angry at you for that and other things!" Other Good Guys- "We are running very fast" Bad Guy- "Oh no I am dead" Good Guy- "Phew, that was lucky" Other Bad Guy- "But you weren't expecting me!" Good Guy- "Apparently I was, whoever you are!" Other Bad Guy- "I shall eat you for fun" Good Guy- "But you weren't expecting this!" Bad Guy- "Oh no! The possibly previously referenced but likely entirely made up for this story thing! My only weakness!" Good Guy- "Thank god I had one possibly previously referenced but likely entirely made up for this story thing left, I was afraid I'd used them all already." Missing/Dead Good Guy- "I am in a cave" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dread Posted January 29, 2009 Author Report Share Posted January 29, 2009 That's what I'm thinking. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Delete Posted January 29, 2009 Report Share Posted January 29, 2009 Well Final Crisis started with Metron teaching a DC caveman character Anthro how to use fire. At the end you see Bruce Wayne drawing Bats on a cave wall as Antro dies next to him of old age. Now if I was Bruce I just would just write, hey Flash can you run your ass real fast through time to pick me up. But it's Bruce so I give him the benefit of the doubt. Maybe he likes the Cromagnon people. Actually I got that bit fine. Its just its all a bit like- Bad Guy- "You cannot defeat me, for I have mastered all time and space in an unspecific way!" Good Guy- "I'm angry at you for that and other things!" Other Good Guys- "We are running very fast" Bad Guy- "Oh no I am dead" Good Guy- "Phew, that was lucky" Other Bad Guy- "But you weren't expecting me!" Good Guy- "Apparently I was, whoever you are!" Other Bad Guy- "I shall eat you for fun" Good Guy- "But you weren't expecting this!" Bad Guy- "Oh no! The possibly previously referenced but likely entirely made up for this story thing! My only weakness!" Good Guy- "Thank god I had one possibly previously referenced but likely entirely made up for this story thing left, I was afraid I'd used them all already." Missing/Dead Good Guy- "I am in a cave" You had to read that Superman 3d book to get the other bad guy thing I think. I didn't read it, but that's what wikipedia said. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stavros Posted January 29, 2009 Report Share Posted January 29, 2009 See I was lost there. THey could have at least given a clue as to who this was and where I could find him previously. The long string of odd new characters and crazy odd science/magical things left me feeling like I was watching Grant Morrison playing Magic: The Gathering against himself with cards he made himself. "I cast Element X to activate the Imagination Machine!". Morrison makes Superman more of a Wizard than a Superhero. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Delete Posted January 29, 2009 Report Share Posted January 29, 2009 Whether it makes sense or not though I think we can all agree Captain Carrot and the Zoo Crew showing up at the end was awesome. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted January 29, 2009 Report Share Posted January 29, 2009 Despite hating Batman RIP, I fully intend to buy this when the trade finally comes out. I bought the first three issues, but was so completely lost that I quit trying to figure it out. I really want to like it, but I feel like I need to study for a test or something before I read Morrison's work. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Delete Posted January 29, 2009 Report Share Posted January 29, 2009 Despite hating Batman RIP, I fully intend to buy this when the trade finally comes out. I bought the first three issues, but was so completely lost that I quit trying to figure it out. I really want to like it, but I feel like I need to study for a test or something before I read Morrison's work. You kinda do need to know every DC character ever. If that's a test? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stavros Posted January 29, 2009 Report Share Posted January 29, 2009 I think that all the crazy imagination that worked so well in All Star Superman just goes awry in Final Crisis, its application to the mainstream DCU feels so unnatural and out of place, plus it suffers immensely by shifting the focus from a small cast to the entire universe. All Star felt like a well honed often tense narrative, Final Crisis feels anything but. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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