The leisurely comic discussion thread

[Stavros]

So, Infinity Gauntlet is basically just Death telling Thanos "No glove no love"?

[Koete]

[KnightWing]

[Dread]

Well, he is the leader of The Hand.

[KnightWing]

So he's now going to turn into the Marvel Universe's GREATEST VILLAIN?

Bigger than Doom and Magneto? Right.

[Stavros]

Daredevil turns evil fakeout #2774. Just this time they're bothering to promote it.

Dude has never once had to actually compromise his ethics to get by in the criminal underworld, let alone shown any signs of actually turning bad. Shadowlands has been building in the book for a while, and at least its clear that he believes the hand have something to offer him, making New York safe. Its just hard to see DD, Tarantula, White Tiger and The Hand as some great threat when 84 bajillion heroes live in New York. I guess we'll find out exactly what Shadowlands entails.

[Koete]

[dc20willsave]

I admit, I think that teaser is kinda cool.

[prez]

I admit, I think that teaser is kinda cool.

[prez]

Associated Press came out with this story over the weekend. It's written in the typical condescending way that idiots talk about comics, but it's an interesting subject.

Biff! Pow! Comic artists clash over copyrights

By TODD RICHMOND

Associated Press Writer

MADISON, Wis. (AP) — Bam! Zap! Whammo! It's a battle royale between two of the toughest heavyweights in the superhero business. The fate of the world doesn't hang in the balance, but a lot of money probably does.

Sci-fi writer Neil Gaiman and former Spider-Man artist Todd McFarlane's attorneys have been sparring for years over Gaiman's claims to a handful of characters created for McFarlane's classic Spawn series, which features a murdered CIA agent who becomes a demon.

Now Gaiman insists McFarlane owes him for three more characters — a demon named Dark Ages Spawn and two avenging angels in thong bikinis. A federal judge in Madison has scheduled a Monday hearing to listen to both sides' arguments.

The long-running case underscores the tension among comic artists as they vie for rights to even minor characters in an industry that has grown more lucrative over the past 20 years through movies, graphic novels and international distribution.

Comic book sales totaled about $429 million last year, up from $360 million to $400 million in 1996, according to estimates by The Comics Chronicles, which compiles comic sales data. The Batman movie sequel "The Dark Knight" has grossed over $1 billion worldwide since it was released in 2008, according to Box Office Mojo.

Spawn isn't nearly as popular as Batman or Spider-Man, but the series has been fairly successful with action figures, an Emmy-winning HBO series and a 1997 movie that grossed $87 million worldwide. A sequel is in development, according to Image Comics' Web site.

Gaiman's attorneys said Gaiman plans to donate any money that comes out of the case to charity. The lawsuit for him is more about establishing clear guidelines for other comic book creators about their rights to characters, they said.

"Our view is McFarlane just took some of the characters Neil was a co-creator of and just gave them different names," said Gaiman's attorney, Allen Arntsen. "It's a matter of principle."

McFarlane's lead attorney, James Alex Grimsley, didn't return several messages seeking comment. In court filings, though, McFarlane's legal team denied Gaiman has any right to the three additional characters, arguing they're based on ideas from the Spawn universe, not other characters.

McFarlane created Spawn in 1992 for a startup comic book company, Image Comics. Gaiman and McFarlane collaborated on early Spawn stories. In 2002, Gaiman sued McFarlane in federal court, arguing he was a co-copyright owner of supporting characters Medieval Spawn, a demon similar to Spawn; Angela, a red-haired angel; and Cogliostro, a one-time Spawn ally.

A jury found in Gaiman's favor later that year. He and McFarlane have spent the past eight years figuring out how much money the three characters have generated and how much Gaiman deserves. A number has yet to emerge.

Gaiman filed a motion in March claiming the demon Dark Ages Spawn and two more angels, Tiffany and Domina, were derived from Medieval Spawn and Angela. They should be figured into the accounting, too, he argued.

Gaiman contends Medieval Spawn and Dark Ages Spawn both wear metal helmets, carry shields and help the defenseless. Tiffany, Domina and Angela, meanwhile, all have long hair and wear armored bras and thong bikinis.

"There's certainly historical examples of minor characters becoming major breadwinners," said Mark Zaid, founder and marketing director of the Comic Book Collecting Association. "Characters start off in a cameo and, to put a pun on it, spawn into something bigger. ... When you succeed, you can hit the lotto."

McFarlane's attorneys counter that while Dark Ages Spawn, Tiffany and Domina have "superficial qualities" similar to other characters, but they have unique personalities and express broad concepts in the Spawn story, including the ideas that demons walked the earth throughout time and God created an angel army to battle them.

Gaiman, who lives in northwestern Wisconsin near the Twin Cities, worked on the "Sandman" comic book series. His novels include "American Gods," "Coraline" and "The Graveyard Book," which won the John Newberry Medal.

McFarlane illustrated a number of big-time superheroes, including Batman and Spider-Man, before co-founding Image Comics. He also manufactures action figures and made headlines in 1999 when he paid $3 million for the baseball Mark McGuire hit for his then-record 70th home run in a season.

McFarlane told The Associated Press in a phone interview he thinks Gaiman is a "good man."

"We just sort of hit a crossroads in the piece of the puzzle in our relationship," he said, choosing his words carefully. "I don't begrudge anybody from taking a strong position if they think something isn't quite right. I try not to get overly worked up about it. Somebody smarter than all of us will tell us where this all will land."

[Stavros]

I admit, I think that teaser is kinda cool.

Black suit Daredevil with red highlights is kinda cool. I'm interested in this, but it has potential to be good or bad.

[Molly]

Hasn't Bullseye "died" like annually for the last three or four years?

[Missy]

Not that I recall.

[Stavros]

Hasn't Bullseye "died" like annually for the last three or four years?

Nah, he's like Joker, he takes a licking and keeps on ticking. Both of them are non-healing factor guys who nevertheless take huge near fatal damage on a regular basis. During Dark Avengers alone Bullseye took damage that should have killed him several times.

I figure DD is killing him in order to resurrect him as an agent of the Hand. Which is interesting, Matt turning his archnemesis into his zombie slave, an ever-present enforcer and constant threat to Matt if he breaks the Hand programming.

I think Matt is just going to go slightly reverse Norman Osbourne here, Normie being a villain attempting to fix the world as a hero, and Matt being a hero trying to protect New York as a villain. Matt's going to need to do some messed up stuff in Shadowlands through, he's weak and directionless in his own book right now.

[Molly]

I mean, they keep doing things to put him on the shelf, but then immediately take him back off. It's happened in Thunderbolts, Dark Avengers and now here.

[Koete]

Spidey Super-Stories is amazing.

[Molly]

Ryan Sohmer is doing a comic book based webcomic called Gutters. The first one is up, and it's awesome. The guy is behind Looking for Group, too, so I couldn't be more pumped.

[Venneh]

I thought I linked that a while ago here. But, yeah, I really like the first one, and if you look in the background, there's all sorts of fun easter eggs.

[Molly]

"The Nazis called. They want their fear of you back."

[Aaron Robinson]

Ugh, god Ryan Sohmer is awful. I’m sorry, but this is drizzling shit.

[Molly]

[Aaron Robinson]

Sorry, I just find the guy to be an insufferable douche. Looking for Group doesn’t bother me at all, but Least I Could Do makes me want to punch babies. This looks to be more like the latter.

[Molly]

Sorry, I just find the guy to be an insufferable douche. Looking for Group doesn’t bother me at all, but Least I Could Do makes me want to punch babies. This looks to be more like the latter.

Really? Because Bucky feels like he's pure Richard, there.

[Aaron Robinson]

I guess just I haven’t read enough Looking for Group then. I doubt I ever will.

[Koete]

The latest one made me chuckle.